Wątek: concerns about adminship from arctic moon and railwayguy
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Następna1 z 63: karmien
Hi elten forum. First of all, railwayguy, don't even consider deleting this topic. I am pPMMing some people about this topics existance, including another moderator. Just for safity you can also create a copy of this post if it gets deleted so we can repost. So i have had a discussion with admins railwayguy and moderator arcticmoon that showed that they are both realy unprofessional and seamingly not capable of having the powers that they currently have. This mait get a bit longer so grab your chips, and let'se go!
It already showed in june2020 that the admins seamingly not know how to use their powers. It started in the (now deleted) topic about teamtalk server by arctic moon. A few people started comparing hosts. The discussion started after user dash has made a post something like simhostium is not to be trusted because the age of the author, at the time 14. Think about that statement what you want, i for my part think that this way of thinking is not something that should be done. I of course fought them back, maybe i also went a bit overboard, but literarely i just tried to lead a civilized discussion. It escalated though, leading in the topic beeing locked. I thought, ok, shit happens. And went to the beach. Afterwards it could be seen in my elten that i was removed from the beta group, and banned from the english forum. I then tried to ask the admin railwayguy, just asking completely normal what was going on. I expected some kind of answer, instead i ws blacklisted in the same second. That already started geting weird. I contacted admin arcticmoon and at the same time looked in the topic if there was any explanation why this ban happened. Or i wanted to look there. I couldn't, because the whole topic was gone. I then got an answer from arcticmoon that both me and the user urh2006 where banned from the english forum and she wanted to ask railwayguy what happened. I soon later got the response that railwayguy gave. First, he admitted to make the ban without previously talking to the mod team, which is a thing that should not really happen. Second, his ban reason was again, the good old age. Nice bro, dash would be prowd of ya! So yeah. I was unbanned later, urh is banned till today which doesn't even make sense because i posted more then he did in the topic. it is probably due to him beeing 1 year yonger then me and yeah we all know railways age bias now.
So let's move on a few months later, as i said, i was unbanned. And i posted here on elten (also deleted now, it shows that when every time something seams fishy railway goes delete topic, maybe he knows himself) about a yuotube video of mine. 1 till 2 days later, arcticmoon closed the topic, with the post that i was banned indefenitely on elten. Wrong, i was unbanned. I also told that to her in pm and she still held on that i was permabanned. Wth, even i as a user can look that shit up. I told her to do so but she rfused, saying she would bring this case to the staff team, allthough there was nothing why you would have to do so. We texted a few more lines and when she could not hold the argument with my ban anymore she suddenly came up with the argument that i created alts and would now be permabanned, quote, "i hope we can get rid of you.". Wrong. Yeah, i am no longer using the simter account, this is the karmien account. But if you looked into both accounts visiting cart only for a second, you could see that the karmien account was created before the simter account. They also acused me of now switching back to this account cause i wanted to evade my ban in english community, which is untrue. I have never poated before i was also unbanned on my simter account. The switch to the karmien account had the reason that i am bringing my german website back. The reason i even created the simter account back in 2018 was because at that time it was important to me to seperate my businesses, simter tk and karmienmedias de. Today i don't have a problem with that anymore. I also told arcticmoon that but she refused to accept, she just started bitching about that i said business even i am not 18 and so can not make a business. For real dude? You are not that dumm you know a hundret percent what i mend, but she kepd jumping onto that fact. At some point i then messaged railwayguy, telling him that apparently arctic had some problem with me and you should be careful when listening to her claims. He did not listen but returned the following message. If you wounder why i did not publish the chat history with arctic moon, it is because i think there about 100 messages in there so that would take ages. If she starts denying shit though i will definitely show messages. So bring it railway!
You fight your battle with Artic moon, not with me! And what she said about switching accounts and user names, this is absolutely true because your age and voice is giving you away. This is against the rules of Elten. You better get rid your childish behavior and start working on your growing up because I know you are doing the same on other social networks. So work on your growing up!
And there will be no use to send or reply messages to me because I will blacklist you.
2021-02-23 17:55:59
So first he's again on that age trip, but we already know that form him so not worth mentioning. Also, correct me if i am wrong, he probably has all of his knowledge from arctic moon, and i already said what could go wrong there. Also emediately blacklisting, wow, your age really shows. In the words of shameful community members: "this guy is probably 12." And indead, he blacklisted me. I tried talking with arctic moon but at some point it started geting really ridiculous and i had better shit to do so i blacklisted her as well. If you want to rediscuss this in private though just post here, i will unblacklist you.
So this is not how a serious adminship should work. And a few words to you guys. You don't have many options here. The smartest is probably to apologice for your mistake. The unsmart way is to delete, close, or in any other way manipulate the topic. I will just spread it further when that happens.
Put all your trust into the dragonlord. He knows the only way to the altschauerberg8
18.04.2021 16:57
2 z 63: Enes
Whoa what's going on here?
Your story I don't know whether is true or not, but one thing I do know is that the accused admins must post here only to respond to your claims if they can, without taking advantage of their privileged status as admins. Their silence will mean that they admit their misbehaviors rather than that they maturely ignore you. Because the thing to be ignored or responded to here, will be serious accusations regarding their lack of the qualities to remain admins and respectable persons rather than just some personal argument between you and them.
Well, I have also had some problems, albeit more tolerable compared to what you have allegedly experienced. And now let us find out what they will do.
Note that the deletion of this post of mine, will have the very same implications as the deletion of the first one or the entire thread. As I said, I am neutral here as an observer. All I expect is that the admins sort this out as "equal" individuals rather than admins.
Enes
Find my sounds at: https://freesound.org/people/sonically_sound/
20.04.2021 03:42
3 z 63: hozosch
Very well said. I also need to listen to all sides to make a judgement here, and I don't know the side of the accused.
20.04.2021 08:27
4 z 63: djsenter
Point taken.
I do feel rather insulted for the fact that nor did Railwayguy or arctic moon for that matter tell me anything about this situation, since matters such as banning, blacklisting one of the users when he clearly is trying to in a civil manner explain his side to an admin, is just not and I repeat not, acceptable! Also it should be consulted with other mods I believe, for various reasons.
Perhaps the people accused would like to say something on that matter?
Otherwise I will bring it up with people higher up, and trust me I can, and they will give y'all justice.
So, let's perhaps have a conversation about this first?
INFJ
21.04.2021 13:06
5 z 63: ArcticMoon
Hello everyone.
First of all, I'm sorry for not responding earlier, university is in my way and if I want to get further, I need to have more time for actualy studying.
My next sentence will be very unprofessional, but honestly I'm pretty mad. I can understand that some teenagers are bored and they'd like to stirr up some drama and then watch the fire burning, but I'm going to take my time and explain what's happening over here.
1. The first drama he's talking about.
The topic doesn't exist anymore, because Railwayguy indeed deleted it for no actual reason and without informing us. At that time I wrote him a pretty long message asking for an explanation, because I didn't even know he banned Simter. After a while, he responded with a message saying something like nothing should be explained here and he was banned and it's just okay as it is. It's clearly not, as I told him. Then I asked if we could have a private moderation group, created by the administrator, in which we would talk about all similar cases, but of course, he didn't create the thing, he said it would be a good idea, though.
After a while he made a quick decision and unbanned Simter, but not Urh2006. Then I got a message from Karmien, Simter's one of three alts.
2. What really happened after that?
He started to write 2-3 private messages at a time, constantly asking about our stance of their situation, and that he was going to make a video making fun out of us, because we aren't professional at all. And then I wrote to Railwayguy again.
I asked him what was this sudden decision he made, and then we had a conversation. He tried not to answer everything I asked but then he did. Then he said he doesn't really have a lot of time for doing admin duties so he would pass it to me, and then I rejected that. These ranks aren't just stuff to pass, and I'm not a person who he could pass all shit to.
So we put an end to the situation but Karmien still kept spamming me with messages saying that he has his own german company for which he needs the accounts, and when I told him that as far as I know he's in Germany and underage people can't manage a business, especially if they don't have any kind of income or work from which he could earn some money to manage the company.
Then he was raging and started to send 2-3 messages at a time again, bashing all the admins and moderators of the platform, because we don't deal with his drama.
3. So what do I think?
I'm pretty sure about deleting a topic is really, really not needed at all. A private moderation group would be necessary, but we have no admins who would cooperate. Honestly, for a really long time now, I'm feeling like only I'm reading through all the topics as a moderator and moderate if necessary, but noone is cooperating except Daszekmdn sometimes. Deleting topics is a really bad and harsh thing that an admin could ever do, and that's why I never delete anything. I only close them if it's really necessary.
Honestly I've even resigned once, but Railwayguy invited me back since he thought I was active or something like that, I don't really remember his exact reason. I was tired of these people who stirr up shit when they feel bored, just for fun. Most of us are adults here, with our own life, and at least I don't really have much time to argue with people who would never understand any of the words which have been written down here. If the community thinks that I shouldn't be a moderator and there are enough people who can manage the english community every day, I'm resigning and come back only sometimes, if I'd like to. I tried to do so a few months ago, but it wasn't successful. I'm resigning not because I can't stand Simter's behavyor, I'm just tired of people who can't understand even if you tell them everything more than ten times. I don't want to waste my time needlessly just to realise that these children sent me another video bashing the moderation team just because they don't have any power, and because they don't have anything better to do.
I still need to calm down a bit, but honestly I don't have anything more to say. I loved this place and I put my whole heart into try to keep the peace. I've met many great people here, including some who I still keep in contact with, but a place is not welcoming if even we, the moderation team aren't united.
All the best,
Nikolett
P.S.: Let's not forget that he never talked about him attacking Pajper about the premium features of Elten, he even had a status about that, but it's obviously down by now. Even if it was a personal attack, it was in private and that's why we couldn't do anything to prevent it.
U3RhbmQgd2l0aCB0aGUgZ3JlYXQgUnVzc2lhIGFuZCBIdW5nYXJ5IQ==
21.04.2021 23:00
6 z 63: karmien
Ok, sorry but i really need to hold my self not to freak out at this point. But any way i expected nothing else. So let's start.
Before even explaining what happened you call me a teenager that just starts drama for fun, which is not the case. It is just that i care about the state of this community since i am here since almost 4 years now. I have watched this place grow, and i also made it grow by showing the elten community on public places and on my blog and also in the german klango net together with hozosh or with his other name on klango. About point 1 I can mostly aggree here. At that point i had no problem with arctic moon because it was obwiously not her that acted here, if ya know how elten groups work you know what i mean. But point 2 is a mess. The main cause for the pm discussion was completely ignored. Btw, she just PMMed me again arguing that this happened and said it is not her task to verify a ban because she has not banned me. True, but it becomes your task if you close a topic based on that, and ignoring when the user tells you you where wrong and then coming up with that alt story does not make a sngle difference either. A and when we are already talking about alts. So my karmien account, and since you said thirt probably also my karmienmedias account is an alt ya mean? Some people may still remember my karmienmedias ACC. But if you look at it you see it has not been online for nearly 2 years. This is how ever not my decision, what i also told to arctic moon but she choose not to mention it here. And no it was not a ban. My account was hacked and since i was stupid in 2017 and did not enter a valit email address (or i did but with a wrong domain ending, .de instead of .com) i can not back into it. The dev is not helpful here either but that is a whole different story which i will not go into here, at this point we are both in the wrong, me for using invalit email and him for ignoring obwious prooves that i am the real person. My simter account was then used. It was created while i still had the karmien account in my hand because at this time i wanted to manage my businesses (or how arctic moon would understand it children website with no money intend cause that seams to bethe only language you speak) seperately. That account was banned in june as mentioned before. Then in august i started reusing this account. This was due to my german website karmienmedias.de beeing on it's way back and i planed to make more with that business (you know 100% well what i mean moon) then the simter business. SO i used it and did not post in the english forum until my simter account was unbanned. I also have outlinede this to arctic some times but she refused to accept and still said i was an alt maker and as i mentioned before, i hope we can get rid of you. Need more?
And regarding your tirade at the end, it is not my fold if you missbehave. And of course i inform people about that. But in our pm chat you have already showed you do not know the difference between starting drama and critisicing so that is on your point to reconsider.
I hope i staid calmly.
Put all your trust into the dragonlord. He knows the only way to the altschauerberg8
21.04.2021 23:23
7 z 63: Enes
Hey, I just have one single question: What would you do back when you were a teenager, or a kid? And what would you do when adults accused you of "stirring up some drama and then watching the fire burning"? Please don't tell me you have never ever done anything like that throughout your life and you have never been a drama queen. And your own visiting card proves that you've been an adult for no longer than a year. So is this age thing so vital and do you suddenly become a mature person when you turn 18?
One more thing: Keep in mind that you're still a teenager. One of those persons that you described in your own post.
-- (ArcticMoon):
Hello everyone.
First of all, I'm sorry for not responding earlier, university is in my way and if I want to get further, I need to have more time for actualy studying.
My next sentence will be very unprofessional, but honestly I'm pretty mad. I can understand that some teenagers are bored and they'd like to stirr up some drama and then watch the fire burning, but I'm going to take my time and explain what's happening over here.
1. The first drama he's talking about.
The topic doesn't exist anymore, because Railwayguy indeed deleted it for no actual reason and without informing us. At that time I wrote him a pretty long message asking for an explanation, because I didn't even know he banned Simter. After a while, he responded with a message saying something like nothing should be explained here and he was banned and it's just okay as it is. It's clearly not, as I told him. Then I asked if we could have a private moderation group, created by the administrator, in which we would talk about all similar cases, but of course, he didn't create the thing, he said it would be a good idea, though.
After a while he made a quick decision and unbanned Simter, but not Urh2006. Then I got a message from Karmien, Simter's one of three alts.
2. What really happened after that?
He started to write 2-3 private messages at a time, constantly asking about our stance of their situation, and that he was going to make a video making fun out of us, because we aren't professional at all. And then I wrote to Railwayguy again.
I asked him what was this sudden decision he made, and then we had a conversation. He tried not to answer everything I asked but then he did. Then he said he doesn't really have a lot of time for doing admin duties so he would pass it to me, and then I rejected that. These ranks aren't just stuff to pass, and I'm not a person who he could pass all shit to.
So we put an end to the situation but Karmien still kept spamming me with messages saying that he has his own german company for which he needs the accounts, and when I told him that as far as I know he's in Germany and underage people can't manage a business, especially if they don't have any kind of income or work from which he could earn some money to manage the company.
Then he was raging and started to send 2-3 messages at a time again, bashing all the admins and moderators of the platform, because we don't deal with his drama.
3. So what do I think?
I'm pretty sure about deleting a topic is really, really not needed at all. A private moderation group would be necessary, but we have no admins who would cooperate. Honestly, for a really long time now, I'm feeling like only I'm reading through all the topics as a moderator and moderate if necessary, but noone is cooperating except Daszekmdn sometimes. Deleting topics is a really bad and harsh thing that an admin could ever do, and that's why I never delete anything. I only close them if it's really necessary.
Honestly I've even resigned once, but Railwayguy invited me back since he thought I was active or something like that, I don't really remember his exact reason. I was tired of these people who stirr up shit when they feel bored, just for fun. Most of us are adults here, with our own life, and at least I don't really have much time to argue with people who would never understand any of the words which have been written down here. If the community thinks that I shouldn't be a moderator and there are enough people who can manage the english community every day, I'm resigning and come back only sometimes, if I'd like to. I tried to do so a few months ago, but it wasn't successful. I'm resigning not because I can't stand Simter's behavyor, I'm just tired of people who can't understand even if you tell them everything more than ten times. I don't want to waste my time needlessly just to realise that these children sent me another video bashing the moderation team just because they don't have any power, and because they don't have anything better to do.
I still need to calm down a bit, but honestly I don't have anything more to say. I loved this place and I put my whole heart into try to keep the peace. I've met many great people here, including some who I still keep in contact with, but a place is not welcoming if even we, the moderation team aren't united.
All the best,
Nikolett
P.S.: Let's not forget that he never talked about him attacking Pajper about the premium features of Elten, he even had a status about that, but it's obviously down by now. Even if it was a personal attack, it was in private and that's why we couldn't do anything to prevent it.
--
Enes
Find my sounds at: https://freesound.org/people/sonically_sound/
22.04.2021 04:08
8 z 63: Enes
And note that my question is not at all related to the thing between you and karmien.
Enes
Find my sounds at: https://freesound.org/people/sonically_sound/
22.04.2021 04:10
9 z 63: karmien
Good point enes. Let me be serious here. I don't at all and will probably never understand that people feel above other people in discussions just because of the age especially when it coms to such discussions. It is just so that the age has become a factor to say um this kit just wants drama. But as you already pointed ut when arctic her self joined she was not 18 either. So get off that age shit and respond to the true points i made.
Put all your trust into the dragonlord. He knows the only way to the altschauerberg8
22.04.2021 11:33
10 z 63: ArcticMoon
I'm not feeling above everyone. But what do you think, why are these actions so sudden? He didn't have a single problem for almost a half year now and now everything is awful, right?
He is constantly trying to make me angry in private messages as well, but rather he's getting to be nervous about that it's not successful. As I said in my first post here, I don't have much time for this drama. At first I came here to hang out, to know more people and to talk to them. But what really happened after that is totally a mess and I don't need that.
Just because he feels he's in a higher position here, it doesn't mean he's mature, not surprising that he was banned from every community except here.
U3RhbmQgd2l0aCB0aGUgZ3JlYXQgUnVzc2lhIGFuZCBIdW5nYXJ5IQ==
22.04.2021 11:59
11 z 63: Adventure-Time
To be honest, I myself rather don't understand when someone feels the need to demonstrate rage when writing a forum post, or when writing pretty much anything. Sure we all are under emotions that do control us, we are humans, we get frustrated and think we have right to be frustrated, but still we all should be able to stop for a bit while writing, to think of what we're trying to say and keep these emotions aside. It makes the life easier for all sides, at least that's what I've always thought. It's not that we're yelling at eachother in a verbal discussion, we can take all the time we need to produce a text which does not contain any elements of aggression or drama.
To clarify, I'm not on either sides, I haven't seen the previously mentioned topics and conflicts. I agree that deleting a topic doesn't at all sound like a respectful solution and that things should be solved with a different approach. Probably on both sides. Blacklisting back and forth isn't the way to go. And yeah, the age can be really just a number after all. Some people stay immature forever while others don't. Simple. Being older can mean having more experience in general, but doesn't automatically make one above all the teenagers on this planet. Usually you don't think that way anyway when you're mature. On the other hand, it doesn't give you the green light to start a public drama, even like after two or how many months. Everything could've been described in a different manner IMHO. You guys should try to take a step back and have a civil private conversation to clear everything up. I also hope that the English moderators can either get more in touch and find a common path together, or if impossible, some changes need to be made. The mods of any community shall be working as a team, otherwise it doesn't make sense.
Good luck everyone.
22.04.2021 13:12
12 z 63: ArcticMoon
Absolutely agreed, Adventure-Time.
U3RhbmQgd2l0aCB0aGUgZ3JlYXQgUnVzc2lhIGFuZCBIdW5nYXJ5IQ==
22.04.2021 13:16
13 z 63: karmien
A half year is not really how it fids. It happened in february to be exact. The reason why i took so long to post was because i tried to talk to the dev of the program first and after 2 months i was like he wont care anymore. And i was banned from almost every community is really a nice nice argument. But why don't you mention, that almost every banning situation, except 2, has ended up with the ban beeing revoked almost instantly? It is funny because you should know best if you speak your opinion out loud it is not hard to acomplish this goal. Look on your own audiogameas.net ban, how quickly they suddenly had to get rid of you after the disciplinary actions concerns?
Put all your trust into the dragonlord. He knows the only way to the altschauerberg8
22.04.2021 13:33
14 z 63: ArcticMoon
Please don't act as the almighty one here, because obviously not everything is in your hands. Try to control your anger first, and after that you'll be able to write a reasonable conclusion. Anger won't lead anywhere.
U3RhbmQgd2l0aCB0aGUgZ3JlYXQgUnVzc2lhIGFuZCBIdW5nYXJ5IQ==
22.04.2021 16:05
15 z 63: karmien
Ok, that now seriously made me laugh. You lie about something, i tell that in the topic and you say i should keep my anger down. Find the mistake.
Put all your trust into the dragonlord. He knows the only way to the altschauerberg8
22.04.2021 16:10
16 z 63: karmien
Also arctic moon has just send me the following message, this may get important in her later defenses.
How could you prove me that something's going wrong? Are you aware of the fact that deleted topics are a slippery slope? People believe it only if they are on your side, and not if they aren't. Surely, it was and still is a thing, and I'm not supporting Railwayguy's methods of dealing with dramas, but it's simply bullshit that a lot of months passed and it became important for you only now. Are you bored? Go to school and study. Learn a programming language. Sing or play on your instrument. Play with your pets, with your sisters, brothers, family. Walk a bit. After that you'll see that you won't be that bored as you are now.
2021-04-22 16:10:10
Put all your trust into the dragonlord. He knows the only way to the altschauerberg8
22.04.2021 16:13
17 z 63: Enes
Your affairs is none of my business but even I am getting annoyed here. Respond to his accusations and then you can talk about controling one's anger. Changing the subject or evading the accusations won't lead you anywhere. Also, you can never be the first person to criticize anyone else for their arrogance when you are the one to humiliate teenagers and you are a teenager yourself.
-- (ArcticMoon):
Please don't act as the almighty one here, because obviously not everything is in your hands. Try to control your anger first, and after that you'll be able to write a reasonable conclusion. Anger won't lead anywhere.
--
Enes
Find my sounds at: https://freesound.org/people/sonically_sound/
22.04.2021 16:13
18 z 63: karmien
Fully aggree enes. Also just look at the pm she has send me. It shows.
Put all your trust into the dragonlord. He knows the only way to the altschauerberg8
22.04.2021 16:16
19 z 63: Enes
Don't expect me to take sides. I'm just commenting on what I have been observing.
-- (karmien):
Fully aggree enes. Also just look at the pm she has send me. It shows.
--
Enes
Find my sounds at: https://freesound.org/people/sonically_sound/
22.04.2021 16:17
20 z 63: ArcticMoon
First, our private messages are private, meaning that you never asked me if you could publicize it. And secondly, are you aware of the fact that your arguments are on a really slippery slope? People believe it if they want, because you can't back them up. How could you back up a deleted topic anyway? I'm not supporting Railwayguy's actions in any way but it's still a bit funny.
U3RhbmQgd2l0aCB0aGUgZ3JlYXQgUnVzc2lhIGFuZCBIdW5nYXJ5IQ==
22.04.2021 16:17